The story I’m hearing elsewhere is he pulled the alarm to delay the vote, as Republicans are violating their “72 hours to read the bill” rule they agreed to at the start of this Congressional term.
While I don’t condone the actions, the result was a delay, long enough for representatives to read a bill they are voting on, which is something that should always be allowed.
I previously read that the 72 page bill was given to House members initially with only about an hour before the vote to read and review it so that helps me make more sense of it than my own face value first conclusion.
Reading a bill is part of a normal procedure and the outcome is more important. So, while I don’t condone the action, at the end of the day, if the outcome benefits people other than himself, then I can understand his action. The thing is they weren’t given enough time to read as Republicans violated their own 72 hours to read the bill rule.
I think McCarthy just found out the only way to stay in power. Every time Gaetz tries to file a motion to vacate the speakership, McCarthy will just pull the fire alarm.
This is not at all correct. The issue in Schenk wasn’t whether you could or could not falsely shout fire in a crowded theater.
You may not falsely yell fire in a crowded theater. Doing so is a criminal breach of peace.
Schenk and Brandenberg are incitement cases. Not being able to falsely yell fire in a crowded theater is axiomatic proof that the framer’s intent wasn’t to ban limits on speech that obviously serves no valid free speech purpose, such as falsely shouting fire in a crowded theater.
You absolutely have the right to truly yell fire in a crowded theater, though no duty to do so!
And someone else was shot by law enforcement because they tried to follow those orders. (The fact she wasn’t innocent doesn’t excuse the instigator of her death)
I don’t think most people who hear the “fire in a crowded theater” line are going to think it’s about protesting war. It’s an example when speech can have an immediate harmful effect that seems to have a lot more relevance to the discussion of limitations on expression.
No, it is about people fundamentally misunderstanding the case and continuing to misuse a paraphrasing of a dictum, or non-binding statement, from Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr. Incorrectly, acting as if it was a an actually point if law.
If used correctly, then it would be about protesting war. But people rarely understand what was said under Schenck v. United States, nor do they understand that it was overturned.
Brandenburg v. Ohio changed the standard to which speecg speech could be prosecuted only when it posed a danger of “imminent lawless action,” a formulation which is sometimes said to reflect Holmes reasoning as more fully explicated in his Abrams dissent, rather than the common law of attempts explained in Schenck.
You would have to prove intent, which is almost impossible. I accidentally set off a fire alarm once. The relevant signage was totally ambiguous and not even remotely clear.
deleted by creator
The story I’m hearing elsewhere is he pulled the alarm to delay the vote, as Republicans are violating their “72 hours to read the bill” rule they agreed to at the start of this Congressional term.
While I don’t condone the actions, the result was a delay, long enough for representatives to read a bill they are voting on, which is something that should always be allowed.
I just find it hilarious that it’s a former school principal that pulled this shit. He’s probably expelled kids for doing the same.
At the same time, he finally gets to experience the hilarity of it.
That certainly adds interesting context.
I previously read that the 72 page bill was given to House members initially with only about an hour before the vote to read and review it so that helps me make more sense of it than my own face value first conclusion.
If only people got this riled up whenever the other side broke the rules…
The fucking rage of people doing minor dumbshit stuff for kind of good reasons. Won’t someone think of the precious norms.
deleted by creator
Yeah, but in this case it seems like the dude was rushing back to fund the government and made a genuine mistake because he was in a hurry.
Reading a bill is part of a normal procedure and the outcome is more important. So, while I don’t condone the action, at the end of the day, if the outcome benefits people other than himself, then I can understand his action. The thing is they weren’t given enough time to read as Republicans violated their own 72 hours to read the bill rule.
deleted by creator
Well, shit. Now they’re all going to do it. Lol
I think McCarthy just found out the only way to stay in power. Every time Gaetz tries to file a motion to vacate the speakership, McCarthy will just pull the fire alarm.
Are they in session while walking the halls?
In session is all time not in recess. They are also protected traveling to D.C. from their home district.
Thank you for clarifying. Could not remember for the life of me.
deleted by creator
Yelling fire in a crowded theater has been protected speech for decades now.
deleted by creator
That was overturned in 69. The case was later partially overturned by Brandenburg v. Ohio in 1969, which limited the scope of banned speech to that which would be directed to and likely to incite imminent lawless action (e.g. a riot).[1]
This is not at all correct. The issue in Schenk wasn’t whether you could or could not falsely shout fire in a crowded theater.
You may not falsely yell fire in a crowded theater. Doing so is a criminal breach of peace.
Schenk and Brandenberg are incitement cases. Not being able to falsely yell fire in a crowded theater is axiomatic proof that the framer’s intent wasn’t to ban limits on speech that obviously serves no valid free speech purpose, such as falsely shouting fire in a crowded theater.
You absolutely have the right to truly yell fire in a crowded theater, though no duty to do so!
deleted by creator
… or yelled “Stop the steal, storm the captial” and someone got trampled to death.
And someone else was shot by law enforcement because they tried to follow those orders. (The fact she wasn’t innocent doesn’t excuse the instigator of her death)
No, because the words aren’t intended to incite lawless acts.
But, falsely pulling a fire alarm and saying words are two different things, and he can and should be charged for it.
No, the case was about protesting war.
So, whenever you use this trope, you continue to support the idea that protesting war is criminal and protesters should be imprisoned.
I don’t think most people who hear the “fire in a crowded theater” line are going to think it’s about protesting war. It’s an example when speech can have an immediate harmful effect that seems to have a lot more relevance to the discussion of limitations on expression.
No, it is about people fundamentally misunderstanding the case and continuing to misuse a paraphrasing of a dictum, or non-binding statement, from Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr. Incorrectly, acting as if it was a an actually point if law.
If used correctly, then it would be about protesting war. But people rarely understand what was said under Schenck v. United States, nor do they understand that it was overturned.
Brandenburg v. Ohio changed the standard to which speecg speech could be prosecuted only when it posed a danger of “imminent lawless action,” a formulation which is sometimes said to reflect Holmes reasoning as more fully explicated in his Abrams dissent, rather than the common law of attempts explained in Schenck.
Fire in a theater is meaningless and useless.
“Free speech is yelling theater in a crowded fire.”
You would have to prove intent, which is almost impossible. I accidentally set off a fire alarm once. The relevant signage was totally ambiguous and not even remotely clear.
That actually is protected speech. Brandenburg v. Ohio
deleted by creator