I did not find that role playing improved my IRL social skills.
I am sorry but unless you had an awful time and quit immediately that is essentially impossible.
I didn’t say I had an awful time; I loved it. I said it doesn’t improve general social skills, which was the OP claim.
Not only did I play AD&D from 12-18, I also played a lot of Traveler, a bit of Runequest and Cyberpunk, and a smattering of other games like Phoenix Command. And I’ll say that my observation is that not only did it not improve my social skills, it didn’t measurable improve those in the various friend groups, some of whom, 40 years later and still gaming, are just about as awkward as when they were in high school.
It’s because it’s fantasy, and the reactions you get from NPCs is what the DM comes up with; they’re not real people, they’re all one person. The gamers in your group could be just as socially awkward as you; all you’re going to learn from them is how to interact with other socially awkward people.
Now, if your party consists of a bunch of extrovert players, you could learn from them. But IME gaming only made things worse: it exacerbated the inside joke, us-vs-the-jocks, we’re skater because we play intellectually stimulating games mentality that contributes to social awkwardness.
Building an echo chamber of friends, most likely much like you in headspace, doesn’t expand your ability to be socially fluid.
You ever been to a convention? There are some really great outgoing people are those. There are also a large number of folks who are just plain fucking awkward. I was one of them.
You know what guaranteed helps with social skills? The military. Enforced, constant interaction with a bunch of people of all personality types that you don’t get to choose.
I am pro-gaming. I think it’s a great pursuit. It might even help improve your basic math skills, but I don’t think it cures cancer, and I don’t think it at all helps with improving general social skills.
And I’ll say that my observation is that not only did it not improve my social skills, it didn’t measurable improve those in the various friend groups, some of whom, 40 years later and still gaming, are just about as awkward as when they were in high school.
You are conflating awkwardness with poor communication skills, they aren’t the same thing at all.
Plenty of charming, boisterous people can walk into any room and dominate it with their charm, DND won’t teach you that, but it will teach you how to converse in your own voice. The point isn’t not to be awkward.
It really doesn’t matter that it is a fantasy, I think that makes it a more powerful as a teaching tool not less.
Also eeew no, almost all the managers I have had that were in the military (ESPECIALLY men) have trash leadership skills where if someone is having a hard time their solution is 1. ignore it, men dont like to talk about feelings 2. gaslight them into shutting up 3. unintentionally or intentionally bully the person in front of their peers so they try harder out of fear.
You are conflating awkwardness with poor communication skills
You believe that social skills aren’t dependent on communication skills?
It really doesn’t matter that is fantasy, I think that makes it a more powerful as a teaching tool not less.
The claim was that it taught social skills. I claim it will only do that if the teachers have excellent social skills. Not all teachers are good, or are good at teaching social skills.
Also eeew no, almost all the managers I have had that were in the military (ESPECIALLY men) have trash leadership skills
You’re conflating social skills, and military experience, with management ;-)
I didn’t say the military made people good managers. Management is a very specific skill set, and you don’t have to be socially fluent to be a good manager, although it helps. And being a good communicator, and having good social skills absolutely does not automatically make you a good leader!
You seem to be reading things in my comments that I’m not saying. For example, that I had a bad time gaming; or that the military makes good leaders. We have a communications gap here; how can I be more clear?
I’m not sure how to read your last paragraph; it seems to be an expression of frustration with men, in general, and I don’t know what kind of response I can provide. You haven’t had positive experiences with ex-military (usually male) managers? How many of those have you had?
You haven’t had positive experiences with ex-military (usually male) managers? How many of those have you had?
Too many and most of them elected themselves to be leaders in situations I was in because they foolishly but decisively believed they were going to have to take charge in order for things to happen.
Oh, yeah. Bias to action is often cultivated, and considered a positive trait. It can be really bad, especially in people who are bad leaders.
I’m sorry you’ve had that experience.
Well it keeps happening because the military acts like it knows on an institutional level how to shape someone who will fight tooth and nail and use every tool at their disposal (even if it doesn’t exist yet and they have to invent the necessary tools themselves) and the rest of society worryingly falls in line about it. Militaries all throughout history have proven exhaustively that their very structure and institutional values primarily promote rule followers who are catastrophically ill-equipped to operate in an environment of rapidly changing rules and evolving tactics.
No, if the militaries of the world actually gave a shit about this good improvisational comedy/theater teachers would all be on the payroll of various different defense agencies and would frequently be retraining military personnel about how war actually works.
You know what is better than everyone having radios and being in constant contact that risks jamming or interception by Electronics Warfare units? Go watch a good live improv show, you will see.
Every large war is a forced remembering that the kinds of people who obsess over the aesthetics and planning of war are wasting time forgetting how one actually fights a war when push comes to shove.
The primary thing good improv teachers help you do is understand intimately the necessary power of acting on instinct the instant something disturbs the status quo to retain initiative while also recognizing being able to step back and let the situation organically resolve itself is winning and ultimately your job is to facilitate those conditions.
OP is going to be the wandering minstrel NPC that The Party sees getting disemboweled by the BBEG when they show up to OP’s town gate
“I said I was a newt, I got b—”
pack of armed raiders attacks me in the middle of the night
Me: “LIGHTNING BOLT! LIGHTNING BOLT! LIGHTNING BOLT! MAGIC MISSILE! LIGHTNING BOLT!”
pack of armed raiders attacks me in the middle of the night
Shit, i gave my weapons to the blacksmith for an upgrade which I’ll get tomorrow.
umm…let’s try to go for a seduction with nat 20
raiders fail to catch you from laughing too hard, bard attack is very effective!
The whole hiding in a bunker nonsense will never work
I’m not planning on surviving any apocalypses.
“head into town and get supplies from the warehouse”
meanders into town
Shit, alright, uh, the quest was… Talk to… I don’t know, are there any cats around? I guess I’ll ask the Wanderer their life story. Maybe they’ll have a clue for me.
me stalking you to figure out your secret safe path to hidden unlooted warehouse and then kill you and steal your plan
cool cool wait this person already walked around this block three times…
… wait they know someone is following them don’t they, THEY ARE TAUNTING ME INTO A TRAP!!!
runs away
you finally remember your goal YOU NEEDED to accomplish today was go the secret stash and you stop collecting flowers and get annoyed at yourself for getting completely distracted
Being a DM taught me to think on my feet, but to make sure to only say what I am confident in so it doesn’t bite me in the ass later. I learned to manage my ADHD compulsive blurting out everything that comes to mind so players can be the focus, and to consider complex and unexpected situations.
Also learned not to focus on blame along with being able to admit mistakes.
We must play with different crowds.
Side note: I’ve been told that recruiters for investment firms like candidates who play MtG because it encourages lateral thinking.
Or both.
