Some politicians are so fearful of former President Donald Trump retaking the White House that “they don’t really want to tell the full truth,” West said. “[Biden has] created the best economy that we can get. Is this the best that we can get? You don’t tell that lie to the people just for Biden to win,” West said in a clip played on CNN Sunday.
[Biden has] created the best economy that we can get…You don’t tell that lie to the people just for Biden to win
Straw man arguments like this are what makes it so obvious Cornell West is full of shit. There isn’t a single damn person who ever said that, but Cornell West wants you to think it’s a majority opinion that he’s fighting against.
Back in the real world, we recognize Biden has taken some serious steps in the right direction regarding infrastructure investment, empowering labor, reducing student loan debt, and increasing the portion of taxes paid by the wealthy, among other things. In the real world, we recognize this is as far as he can go with a razor thin Senate majority that depends on the votes of Manchin and Sinema, and we recognize he now has a Republican House to stymy every one of his priorities.
To get progressive policies passed, elect more Democrats to the House and Senate and reelect Joe Biden
U just created a straw man, to defeat his straw man. Well done sir.
How
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I appreciate you
The typical straw man argument creates the illusion of having refuted or defeated an opponent’s proposition through the covert replacement of it with a different proposition (i.e., “stand up a straw man”) and the subsequent refutation of that false argument (“knock down a straw man”) instead of the opponent’s proposition.
[Biden has] created the best economy that we can get…You don’t tell that lie to the people just for Biden to win
You assume that West has created a straw man. He claims that the economy could be better. Whether it’s true or not is up to the reader. In order for it to be a straw man, it would have to be untrue. If it is true, then it is not a straw man.
Let’s assume that his statement is true. That the economy could be better. By treating it as untrue, you create the straw man. You then proceed to refute his assertion by listing Biden’s economic accomplishments, thus tearing down the straw man you created.
Remember, this is all dependent on whether West’s statement is true or not. If the reader thinks it true. Then it is not a straw man.
You heavily edited this after I responded, so here’s my edit. Cornell West is saying “THEY are saying this is the best economy you can get. I don’t think this is the best it can get!” The first statement, literally no one is saying that. It’s an argument he invented to argue against. It is not true. The second statement is something literally everyone agrees with. Everyone would like to be doing better financially. Cornell West made up an argument and then knocked it down with something everyone agrees with.
To be fair, I don’t think the use of the Straw Man Fallacy is appropriate concerning the economy. Because a good or bad economy is open to interpretation. But you used the term, creating a de facto “straw man.” You then refuted it. I’m not defending West or his statement. And I find it fascinating how you were able to do that. Thus, my comment.
Edit: I am not a logician. This is just how I interpreted it.
Cornell West is a fraud paid for by the right wing. Please don’t fall for his bullshit. I’m glad Sanders sees it.
cornel west is a respected academic and activist.
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i don’t think he does.
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i don’t think cornel west has been bought off. i tihnk he’s running to be president of the empire to dismantle the empire, and i think that because that’s what he’s said and i believe him.
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The ones that had their price was people like Bernie, who sold us out with his sheepdog rhetoric. Liberals love Bernie now that hes pulled back his mask and has fallen in line
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EnderWi99in is a fraud paid for by the right wing. Please don’t fall for his bullshit.
Everyone who disagrees with me is a paid shill, sure sounds like some rightwing cope.
The centrist liberals pathological inability to tolerate even small amounts valid and reasonable criticism is part of why democrats keep losing elections.
Where’s your criticism of Cornel and his unpaid taxes and child support?
Racist trope much?
Stop trying to woke snipe legitimate criticisms of Dr. West
what is legitimate about this criticism? it’s ineffectual mud slinging: anyone who agrees with what cornel west says will not think this is a meaningful criticism at all.
Thats a non issue made into an issue by racists that want to keep a non democrat challenger from running, dems love the black community as long as they stay in line and do as they are told. The moment they stray from the official narrative they need to go, exactly like they did with MLK. Democrats talk about protecting democracy while smearing challenger candidates, suing to keep challengers off the ballots, suing to keep RCV off the ballots and calling minorities too ignorant to understand it as justification. West has more in common with the struggles of the working class than out of touch politicians like Biden and Co
Being half a million dollars in tax debt is not a non issue, are you insane?
No, while you are being distracted over bullshit like taxes you are probably not challenging issues like the DNC suing to keep RCV off ballots, why they feel entitled to every ones votes despite not earning them, why we are being told everything is great when we can all see its not. Democrats love a black man that does as hes told until he speaks out of line, then the daggers come out. They havent strayed to far from their plantation owner roots.
cornel west doesn’t need to pay taxes or child support until we dismantle the empire.
Strawmanning your opponents is on page 2 of the rightwing playbook.
Can you at least try to counter Dr. West’s arguments? If you can’t, then just admit it. There’s no shame in admitting weakness.
I’m not strawmanning Cornel, he has nearly half a million dollars in unpaid child support. Also plenty of other folks are taking on that aspect of his candidacy, pretending he’s not deeply in debt is not taking his candidacy seriously and I don’t think anyone who simply ignores the financial trouble he’s in should be regarded as serious.
I don’t think anyone who simply ignores the financial trouble he’s in should be regarded as serious.
poisoning the well
he has nearly half a million dollars in unpaid child support.
that’s a lie
have you considered reading articles before you link them?
State sanctioned media is always the most trustworthy…right?
Inaccuracy, it’s child support and taxes
you can edit your comments on lemmy.
Cornell West SHOULD know better then doing stunts like this. Because even if the criticism is correct, he is siphoning blue-voters away to a politically useless or damaging position, like the Green-Party.
Which means he weakens the Democrats.
Which in turn means he strengthens the Fascist-GOP.
We can aknowledge the Truth, but always vote and always vote blue. NEVER risk a blue vote for the need to pride yourself on “fighting the corrupt system”.
Emotional validation is never an argument for weakening the only thing holding back Fascism in the US. To much is at stake!
Ive been voting since the mid 80s and EVERY election has been ‘theres too much at stake.’
West isnt syphoning off votes, if Biden or Democrats actually represented the public there would be no concern about him having a challenger and he would win by a landslide, but they dont represent us, they represent capital and only capital. The world is on fire and they are telling us we are ok, most of us can see things are not ok, but getting worse. And the part about splitting the vote is liberal myth, if there was no 3rd party candidate running we still wouldnt vote for the cause of most of our problems.
@K1nsey6 @Ekybio So when you find out the @GOP will be funding the “No Labels” & #GreenParty you’ll be good with that?
I’m expecting them to actually, if it hasn’t happened already. Because they know both will siphon blue votes away from their only RELEVANT opposition.
Except the part where thats not happening. Though the DNC has been known to fund right wing candidates, and oppose dems that challenge their ‘public stance’
Sure…
if the criticism is correct, he is siphoning blue-voters away
good. that’s the plan. how is he supposed to win the presidency without someone who previously voted democrat?
Sellout sheepdog says what?
Voting against the Democrats to get us ranked choice voting can work on a local and state level. It’s worked best when communities are mobilized and well-organized and educated about the intention to do so. For example, Democrats have tried to primary AOC multiple times.
But voting against Biden on the federal level is taking a huge risk. The gane theory states that doing so will spoil the vote and givr Trump a better chance at winning. Don’t split the vote on the Presidential ticket.
Don’t split the vote on the Presidential ticket.
if democrats are worried about splitting the vote, they can vote for the green candidate, since greens obviously won’t be deterred by democrat admonishment.
Splitting the vote is liberal myth, we wouldnt vote for your Wall Street hand picked candidates if there was no 3rd party candidate running.
I dont really understand why. I’m trans, not a liberal. I obviously want Biden to win - and it seems even if he is a wall street friendly liberal, he… also wants to give aome kindling to the left. The president will never be able to advocate for the working class the way unions of us can.
You dont understand what, splitting the vote? Biden is not wall street friendly, hes owned by them. They call the shots in government, not its politicians.
Yeah well for me thats not enough of a reason to vote against him. If he loses I’m in deep shit l, because I am trans.
If he loses I’m in deep shit l, because I am trans.
unless he loses… to cornel west.
LMFAO
I never thought Donald Trump could beat Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio, and jeb bush. but here we are.
What have they done to protect you?
I - what? Oh wow you are quite right that Biden has done fuck all over this ‘states rights’ trans issue. But of course even nothing is better than the imminent danger that the GOP has planned.
Biden and Co inaction, and his lifetime of pushing for states rights has resulted in where we are right now.
How long ago did the bathroom discussions start? And when was the last federal politician that even addressed the issue? When has someone thats attacked an individual or group of people in the trans community been convicted under the Matthew Shepard And James Byrd, Jr Act? They don’t care about trans, or gay, or minorities other than our ability to keep them in power, to do nothing.
They did the same thing with women’s reproductive rights, fucked around for 50 years and kept promising to make it law until SCOTUS said shit or get off the pot. They raised millions keeping liberals in fear over what republicans might do if we dont give money and keep them in power.
I have no clue how old you are, but Ive been of voting age and came out in the mid 80s and its been the same song and dance every two years, decades have gone by and that progress they keep promising is always just out of reach.
They don’t care.
