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I’ve definitely had some rural evenings that would have been better with the ability to shoot some cans.

I don’t think that’s the kind of “better” you were talking about

Why do you keep bringing “am” into this.
again none of what I said has anything to do with the definition of “am”

And why are you being so rude on what is clearly a silly thread?

My “argument” isn’t that “midnight itself makes no sense”
My argument is that having the day start at midnight isn’t how people intuitively conceptualize a day, and wouldn’t it be nice if the calendar day more closely resembled our intuition about days (a contiguous daytime period followed by a contiguous nighttime period).

Pyjamas are for wearing wherever tf you want

You can still have that, but base the start of the day on dawn(ish).

I do like metric time in principle, but also base 12 is better than base 10 so I’m torn

It’s nice because people intuit and talk about days as a contiguous daylight period followed by a contiguous nighttime period, when they aren’t having discussions about timekeeping. It’d be nice if we picked an arbitrary delineation that aligned to that.

Wrt doing math, realistically you could just pick an arbitrary day of the year as your reference and every day begins at a multiple of 24 hours from that. No math is needed.
I’m not looking for perfect alignment with local dawn in every location on the planet, I’m aiming for a calendar day that aligns with our intuition of the day/night cycle.
But more than that, I’m having a silly discussion about timekeeping.

The definition of “AM” didn’t factor into anything I said, though.

You said “5am is morning”, but i said “before 5am” as in the entire time from midnight to 5am. I reminded you that “before 5am includes 00:01” which very much isn’t what people would consider to be morning.

This is a silly post about timekeeping, I’m not sure why you’re being rude about it.

I’m aware, but that is a modern problem only. And for that, we could have modern solutions that approximate dawn.

The goal isn’t for it to be perfect day start at sunrise, it’s for it to be conceptually satisfying and more closely match how we talk and intuit about days.

00:01 isn’t the morning. This isn’t negotiable. You’re wrong.

I don’t understand what you mean here, why would “before dawn of the 3rd” become 00:00-08:00 of the 2nd?

I’m saying to shift what 00:00 is, to align with dawn(ish), so that a calendar day is comprised of a contiguous day followed by a contiguous night, which is how we typically intuit about days anyways when we aren’t talking about time.

I know there are practical modern issues with this, but this is a silly post about how unsatisfying it is for the day to start at midnight

It kinda depends on what kinds of daily activity they can learn and what the nature of the support is.

Like, reading the description, I’m thinking of elderly dementia patients, and I wouldn’t call them “pretty much vegetables”, even if they need very intensive assistance.

But I suppose “pretty much” can cover a very wide range for different people.

I’d argue that calling the second after midnight to get “early morning” is confusing. But this is all silly to begin with.

And don’t even get me started on months and seasons.
Or time.

Naw, the start of the day should be at the start of the day. within a margin of error.

When you say “I don’t think it happens at the same time” that’s only because you’re counting arbitrarily from midnight. If you counted from dawn, then midnight wouldn’t happen at the same time every day.

There are reasons why actually using dawn is bad.
But the thrust I’m making is that it’s unsatisfying because we intuit that a “day” is a contiguous day followed by a contiguous night, but that’s not what it really is.

Right, but then how do you refer to before 5am on the 5th?
That’s not morning, and it’s not the night of the 4th. It’s awkward.

But more importantly, it’s ugly. It’s not how we intuit about days. It’s unsatisfying.

People don’t typically call immedi after midnight “early morning”.

But also this is a silly post.
maybe I should have said “unsatisfying” instead of “sucks”. The way the calendar works doesn’t match how we typically intuit a day.

I mean, look at my name.

And also this is a silly post where I complain about how it feels bad that a calendar day doesn’t consist of a single contiguous day and single contiguous night, even though that’s kind of how we intuit about it.

Can’t argue with that!

Morning and predawn are typically the times immediately surrounding dawn, not the time immediately after midnight.

If you told me “were going out to take photos at predawn” I’d assume you meant blue hour photos, not moonlit photos.

I mean, I’m having fun arguing pedantics, but this is a pretty silly post. There is no room here for real practical solutions!

Right.

But 00:01 is clearly still night. Night is typically considered from dusk til dawn.

So if we say “the night of the 2nd” then that’s from dusk til 23:59:59 of the 2nd.
Which is then followed by night that isn’t the night of the 2nd nor night of the 3rd.
And I’d say “before dawn” or “early morning” of the 3rd would be problematically ambiguous.