Late stage western Rome was kinda fine, they even had Christianity kinda receding (Goths and Vandals were far more pious Christians, while in Rome there was plenty of support for restoring the old state religion). What really killed them was intrigue and inability to hold the territory militarily.
Late stage eastern Rome can be divided into a few different long periods. If we mean after being crusaded, then it was shattered and trying to recombine into something useful, eventually finished by Ottomans. If we mean before - well, there was the long period of Seljuk conquest of Anatolia, initially a result of the empire being weakened by conquests against its buffer states and allies which didn’t really have to be conquered. But in any case it’s probable that the same thing would happen, the Seljuk armies of the initial invasion time are described as quite numerous, and they had a few military innovations east Romans didn’t have.
I think he meant later stage westen Rome before the Gothic/Vandals/Longobardic tribes conquered it. A paper tiger entirely convinced of is own superiority whilst their military power and world control slowly dwindled.
So basically what you summed up in a sentence. The eastern Roman and Seljuks need not have been brought into this, I think.
Well, lacking troops due to big demographic and agricultural changes outside your control is not the same as being a paper tiger. Their internal turmoil coincided with a military threat.
Also western thalassocracies have been accused of being largely paper tigers a few times in their history, yet from Ottomans to Napoleon to German Empire to USSR no contenders managed to prove it.
OK, what matters is the OP’s point on lies. I agree with that entirely. Lies brought the USSR down, and the same has unfortunately caught up with its Cold War adversaries. It just became visible a bit earlier that this state is not going into space colonizing everything and is not building a classless society with everyone equal and free. But 40 years later, I think, we can confidently say that neither is USA fulfilling its own “cold war promise”. 30 years ago I suspect even many Americans sincerely believed that it is. Everyone thought it was one side’s defeat, while in fact it was a draw with both sides failing.
Late stage western Rome was kinda fine, they even had Christianity kinda receding (Goths and Vandals were far more pious Christians, while in Rome there was plenty of support for restoring the old state religion). What really killed them was intrigue and inability to hold the territory militarily.
Late stage eastern Rome can be divided into a few different long periods. If we mean after being crusaded, then it was shattered and trying to recombine into something useful, eventually finished by Ottomans. If we mean before - well, there was the long period of Seljuk conquest of Anatolia, initially a result of the empire being weakened by conquests against its buffer states and allies which didn’t really have to be conquered. But in any case it’s probable that the same thing would happen, the Seljuk armies of the initial invasion time are described as quite numerous, and they had a few military innovations east Romans didn’t have.
I think he meant later stage westen Rome before the Gothic/Vandals/Longobardic tribes conquered it. A paper tiger entirely convinced of is own superiority whilst their military power and world control slowly dwindled.
So basically what you summed up in a sentence. The eastern Roman and Seljuks need not have been brought into this, I think.
Well, lacking troops due to big demographic and agricultural changes outside your control is not the same as being a paper tiger. Their internal turmoil coincided with a military threat.
Also western thalassocracies have been accused of being largely paper tigers a few times in their history, yet from Ottomans to Napoleon to German Empire to USSR no contenders managed to prove it.
OK, what matters is the OP’s point on lies. I agree with that entirely. Lies brought the USSR down, and the same has unfortunately caught up with its Cold War adversaries. It just became visible a bit earlier that this state is not going into space colonizing everything and is not building a classless society with everyone equal and free. But 40 years later, I think, we can confidently say that neither is USA fulfilling its own “cold war promise”. 30 years ago I suspect even many Americans sincerely believed that it is. Everyone thought it was one side’s defeat, while in fact it was a draw with both sides failing.