The Pentagon has halted shipments of critical US Patriot air defence systems and other precision weapons to Ukraine after concern that US stockpiles are running too low, prompting alarm in Kyiv.

At the end of last week’s Nato summit, Donald Trump hinted that supplies of Patriot missile interceptors were running down because some had been supplied to Israel, though he suggested he would like to help Kyiv.

After a meeting with Ukraine’s Volodymyr Zelenskyy, the US president acknowledged that Ukraine did “want to have the anti-missile systems, as they call the Patriots, and we’re going to see if we can make some available”.

But Trump added: “They’re very hard to get. We need them. We were supplying them to Israel,” implying that supporting Israel in its war with Iran – a priority for the Republican administration – had set back its willingness to help Kyiv.

    • MarxMadness@lemmygrad.ml
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      7 hours ago

      They think Palestinians should be driven from their homes or exterminated. They don’t care how many Palestinians die, so why would they make that argument? I’ve never heard a zionist say that.

      If you care how many Ukranians die, you’d want the war to end sooner rather than later. The peace terms aren’t getting any better, so all their government is doing is getting more of their people killed.

      • rumimevlevi@lemmings.world
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        24 hours ago

        Not all zionists are honest scum. There is the type who say palestinians should resist and they will save palestinians life. They say if hamas never attacked the over 60k dead palestinians would have been saved.

        I would like ukranians to stop dying but not by giving up part of their land

        • MarxMadness@lemmygrad.ml
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          7 hours ago

          There is the type who say palestinians should resist… They say if hamas never attacked

          If anyone says this, they don’t mean it, because it’s completely contradictory. They’re lying to you.

          I would like ukranians to stop dying but not by giving up part of their land

          There’s no future resolution to this war that leaves Ukraine with more land than they have today. Continuing the war just means it will end with less Ukranian land and less Ukranians.

          It’s unlike Palestine because Russia is not fighting a war of extermination and is not trying to drive residents from their homes. The people in the parts of pre-war Ukraine that Russia now controls aren’t being massacred or evicted; they are predominantly Russian speakers who had (to be charitable to Ukraine) legitimate grievances with the Ukranian government after the U.S.-backed coup in 2014.

          From the Ukrainian perspective, there is actually a benefit to a peace on Russia’s terms: Ukraine keeps more of its land and its people stop dying. There’s nothing to be gained by continuing the war because it isn’t going to turn around. This is again unlike Palestine, where peace on Israeli terms would involve at minimum the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians, and where western public support for Israel has collapsed.

          • rumimevlevi@lemmings.world
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            6 hours ago

            If anyone says this, they don’t mean it, because it’s completely contradictory. They’re lying to you.

            I said it’s a terrible excuse so i reject their argument. It’s true that if Palestinian never resisted over 60k would never die in 2 years but still nobody can strip their right to resistance and the over 60k dead Palestinians responsibility lay exclusively on Israel

            There’s no future resolution to this war that leaves Ukraine with more land than they have today. Continuing the war just means it will end with less Ukrainian land and less Ukranians.

            Palestinians continuing to resist like i already said also caused them to lose more lands every time , it’s still unacceptable. Russia and Israel are both claiming that control of those land are for purely security reasons

            It’s unlike Palestine because Russia is not fighting a war of extermination and is not trying to drive residents from their homes. The people in the parts of pre-war Ukraine that Russia now controls aren’t being massacred or evicted; they are predominantly Russian speakers who had (to be charitable to Ukraine) legitimate grievances with the Ukrainian government after the U.S.-backed coup in 2014.

            I didn’t mean to say Russia/Ukraine and Israel/Palestine is exactly the same but i still standing with my view that there is similar excuses. Another similarity is how both use the argument of the group of person not existing . Israel say that there is no Palestinians and all the land is our , Russia say that Ukrainians are just Russians that Ukraine was simply part of Russia .

            I think Russia could have with economic pressure alone stop Ukraine from joining NATO especially if they convince China that a NATO Ukraine which protect the United state interests in the world is a risk for China too . The war was really overkill. Occupation also is required to be temporary, yet Russia has not stated a plan to when they could approximately give back those lands. What can stop Russia from saying forever that there is a risk that Ukraine join NATO?

            • MarxMadness@lemmygrad.ml
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              4 hours ago

              nobody can strip their right to resistance and the over 60k dead Palestinians responsibility lay exclusively on Israel

              Palestinians and Ukranians both have a right to resist attackers. I’m saying it’s sensible for Palestinians to do so (because their attacker has stated their intent to exterminate them, so it’s either fight or die), but not sensible for Ukrainians to do so (because their attacker just wants them not to join NATO, and because there is no realistic hope of the war turning around).

              As for who’s responsible for the deaths: Ukraine’s government almost immediately sold out their people when they (on the advice of Boris Johnson) backed out of ceasefire agreement they had tentatively agreed to in the opening weeks of the war. By choosing to use their people to fight a proxy war for NATO when there was an easy out on the table, they are partly responsible for the deaths of their people.

              Israel say that there is no Palestinians and all the land is our , Russia say that Ukrainians are just Russians that Ukraine was simply part of Russia .

              It cannot be overstated how completely different these situations are. Israel is trying to exterminate Palestinians. Russia does not want Ukraine to be part of a hostile, nuclear-armed military pact. Palestinians are fighting because otherwise Israel will kill them. Ukrainians are fighting because their coup government is having its strings pulled by NATO.

              I think Russia could have with economic pressure alone stop Ukraine from joining NATO

              They tried since 2014, and Ukraine still wouldn’t give it up (or keep their domestic fascist groups from attacking Russian speakers in Eastern Ukraine). It turns out Ukraine and NATO weren’t even negotiating in good faith, as Angela Merkel admitted about the Minsk II agreement.

              • rumimevlevi@lemmings.world
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                4 hours ago

                It cannot be overstated how completely different these situations are. Israel is trying to exterminate Palestinians. Russia does not want Ukraine to be part of a hostile, nuclear-armed military pact. Palestinians are fighting because otherwise Israel will kill them. Ukrainians are fighting because their coup government is having its strings pulled by NATO

                While i agree russia isn’t trying to ethenic cleansing ukranians the argument they use it’s still the same in my opinion. I think Putin want to make ukraine part of russia without erasing ukrsnian identity but if ukranians want to stay independent russia should respect that. I don’t see any other reason why Putin said that Ukraine used to be part of Russia

                • MarxMadness@lemmygrad.ml
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                  4 hours ago

                  Who cares if the arguments resemble one another? The underlying situations are what determine if the argument makes any sense.

                  “I was afraid for my life” is a fine argument for firing back if someone pulls a gun and starts shooting at you. It’s ridiculous when it comes from a cop who opens fire on a kid with something in his hands.

                  if ukranians want to stay independent russia should respect that

                  The parts of Ukraine Russia controls right now were trying to break away from Ukraine before the war. And again, Russia is not trying to conquer Ukraine – the goal is to keep Ukraine out of NATO.

                  • rumimevlevi@lemmings.world
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                    3 hours ago

                    I was afraid for my life" is a fine argument for firing back if someone pulls a gun and starts shooting at you. It’s ridiculous when it comes from a cop who opens fire on a kid with something in his hands.

                    Only if the risk is so eminent . Israel used the same argument to occupy gaza and the west bank in 67. Even if Israel goal of occupation is extermination of Palestinians and Russia is to make Ukraine part of Russia again occupation is occupation .

                    I don’t see any other way to interpret Putin mentioning that Ukraine used to be part of Russia and that Ukrainians are just Russian

                    The parts of Ukraine Russia controls right now were trying to break away from Ukraine before the war

                    I know that there is separatist movements in them but we don’t know how much of the population backing it up